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Andy and Melissa Beshore

Friday, August 08, 2008

Election Pure And Simple - Jeff Noblit

Has the doctrine of election always been something that was very confusing or hard to understand? Have you never gotten a good, simple explanation of election? If not, this will be of great benefit to you, even if you think you may understand it already. Also, on the Amazing Grace DVD by The Apologetics Group, it speaks about this subject as well among other things, and we HIGHLY recommend it. Click here for more info. He also discusses the common objections against election and he refutes them.

What is election pure and simple? -

"We come to the third view of election and that is what I call election pure and simple. Election pure and simple, and I want you to hear very clearly this very simple definition.... God chose those whom He would save, and He secured their salvation. God chose those whom He would save AND He secured their salvation. From before the foundation of the world, Ephesians 4 and other texts, God elected, chose, selected those He would save. And then in time and space history, He sent His Son to die. His Son paid for the sins of His people on the cross. And then also in time and space history, He called those whom He had chosen, whom His Son paid their sin debt to come to Himself and believe in Him and be everlastingly saved. That's election. Pure and simple." ~ Jeff Noblit

"This little ol' pitiful god of the Arminian, this little ol' anemic, impotent little God that sits in heaven and wrings his hands and hopes somebody might receive him and accept him somehow and make poor little ol' Jesus feel better about dying on the cross. Hogwash! That's not what God teaches! God teaches that all of those whom Jesus Christ paid for on the cross who are foreknown and predestined will be called, will be saved, will be glorified and Christ's holy bride will be complete in heaven for all eternity, just as God designed from the foundation of the world!" ~ Jeff Noblit

You can find it by clicking here.


jeleasure said...

Hey folks,
In listening to just under ten minutes of the audio message, I came to the conclussion that the minister is equating Salvation with entering Heaven. Though, Jesus says, "not every one who says, "Lord, Lord" will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Jesus also introduced a new law. Most translations write command. However, James and Paul say this is very important. James calls the law of love, a "Royal Law". Paul says that the only thing that matters is faith (In Jesus) expressing itself in love (Love for one another). Love is the new law, the part of the new covenant. We must do this to enter Heaven. Entering Heaven is as if we are saying, "I'm going to live with my family".
So, I conclude, another minister who has suggested a simple approach. However, Romans five and six give us the entire formula; step-by-step. If you notice at around Romans 6:19-21, Paul clearly says that the benefit we reap, "Righteousness", leads to holiness and the end is eternal life. So, holiness, being evidenced by our actions is a requirement. You don't work for your salvation. But you need to have the family image if your going to Heaven.

jeleasure said...

Hi thanks for the reply.
I'm not hostile toward Calvinism. I'm also not Arminean. I developed my Faith from the understanding of the Greek words for Righteousness and Holiness. In Romans Six, Paul finishes a run on a pattern that ends in 'everlasting life' following holiness, which follows 'righteousness'. In the verse I am refering to, 19, I believe, Paul says, "The benefit we reap". This is "Righteousness". However, if there is any doubt, it is identified earlier in the chapter.
I did not need to listen to the entire audio to understand what the minister was saying. In fact, you clarified this for me when you stated what Armenians believe.
One problem I have with Calvinism, is there is no understanding given as to the importance of having love for one another. Love for one another is what would be required to be considered holy, or sanctified. This is an act and it is involved in the last part of the formulat Paul lays out for us in Romans six.
The Calvinistic view sees it as something that is suggested. Because, 'I'm chosen and God is taking me to Heaven even if I will not to go' type theology.

Anyway, I can understand why you don't understand what I am saying. First, I did not care to write very much. Second, Calvinism does not regard Love for One another, the law of the New Testament as something we must do. And third, getting saved does not mean a person will go to Heaven.
I do not have a harsh tone in writing this. I am just running through it.
I wrote a manuscript at link Love One Another .
It may take some time for us to understand what each of us believes. However, if the two of you (I'm not sure who I am writing to) would like to discuss it, I will take the time to correspond with you.

Our family said...

Thanks for leaving a comment on our site. I wish you would've listened to the whole sermon before forming your opinion about Jeff Noblit and what he was trying to say in under 10 minutes. That's not enough time to understand where he's coming from.

I was a little unclear of the point you were trying to make, but Jeff is preaching the doctrine of election and he was saying that God chooses us, not that we choose Him. It's the doctrine of grace, not something we merit ourselves.

I'm not sure what you meant by saying he has a "simple approach" to salvation except that you inferred that by the title of the sermon. Election has typically been a difficult doctrine for people to understand, so he explained it simply is all.

He isn't saying that getting into heaven is easy, per se. He's merely saying that God chooses His elect and HE secures their salvation. The Arminian view teaches that there is something we must do to get into heaven, by works or having some inherent goodness, or by having enough faith, but this isn't what the Bible teaches at all.

God has mercy on whom He will have mercy and it has nothing to do with us. It's up to His good pleasure who He will elect. This is contrary to what is preached in most contemporary church pulpits.



Check out some of these verses on election: Matt. 20:16, Matt. 22:14, Mark 13:27, Luke 18:7, John 15:16, Acts 13:48, Rom. 11:17, Ephes. 1:4,5, Matt. 24:22,24,31, Mark 13:20,27, Rom. 8:33, Col. 3:12, 1 Tim. 5:21, 2 Tim. 2:10, Titus 1:1, 1 Pet. 1:2, 1 Pet. 5:13, 2 John 1:1, 2 John 1:13.